Massium 2.0 - Part 4

[jpmuscle]

Massium 2.0 - Part 4
By MusclMarveler

My once just-right sized tank and shorts were now super-tight. As i strolled towards the exit, gawking guys and smiling girls followed me out. I bunched up my pecs for them all as i strolled through the front door. I got in my car, and drove back to the Sports Emporium, hoping to find the tight-bodied cashier i had encountered earlier. I entered the nearly empty store and spotted her at her register, and strolled briskly to where i had found the tanks and shorts before.

I found the aisle and grabbed an XXL tank and the same-sized shorts. I heard footsteps coming around the corner, and glanced over to see the sexy cashier at the end of the aisle with a confused look on her face.

"Are you...? No! Are you the guy who was in here earlier?" The look on her face told me she was thinking 'it can't be!!!!!'

I smiled as i turned and faced her in all my glory. "You know that tank i bought today...?" I beamed as i flexed my chest for her.

"So thaaaaats what that was!" she smiled, seeming to be attracted to my buff body! She didn't seem to be all that surprised, but more like she was happy about the transformation!

"I can't believe it either!!" I beamed, "I'm gonna go home and use some more of it!!!" It kinda slipped out of my mouth.

She smiled again. Her eyes twinkled as she looked me up and down, staring slightly longer at the bulge in my shorts. "Can I join you!" she said in a slightly sexy voice. "I get off work in a few minutes."

I was stunned. She didn't even seem the least bit nervous about my ability to grow muscle. "Sure!" I quickly replied. I began to feel the power of my new physique, and shot back and equally sexy and ultra-masculine response.

She bit her bottom lip and walked over to me. She put one hand on my waist and the other on my chest. She gasped as she felt their hardness, and again as i flexed the pec she was holding. She moaned silently as she followed my chest up to my shoulder and then down my arm.

"I've always fantasized about a man with big muscles!!" she whispered. "And these are kinda small, wouldn't you say?"

I was ecstatic. I still could not believe this fit hotty was gettin all bent outta shape over my superpowered body. Then I remembered: I had just gained over 50lbs of muscle since she saw me last!! Her fetish for men with size had now come abundantly clear, and I was about to rock her world.

"I'll meet you at the front of the store when your shift is done... um, what was your name?" I'm STILL A DORK! I glanced down at her name tag as she blirted it out.

"Kristen. and you are...?"

"Joe. How long till you're done?"

She looked at her watch. "About 20 minutes. 'Gotta count my register and I'll be done."

I put my hands around her waist, feeling how fit she really was. "See you then!" A strong squeeze made her beam as she too had some serious definition to her body as well. I watched her drum-tight ass as she walked away, making my cock jump and my shorts groan into submission. I shopped around for the 20 minutes, grabbing a few more shirts and shorts, pants, socks, etc. Nothing too exciting, actually, for a guy that was about to become a Muscle God!!! I figured XXL would be a good size to start with, and headed for the front. I got Kristen to check me out (in more ways than one) and i stood at the entrance of the store as i waited for her to finish.

---

We arrived at my house, and I picked her up in my arms to climb the stairs. She didn't seem to weigh anything. I put her down as we entered my room. I reached down to pull of my tank, and she darted over and grabbed my hand.

"Leave it on!" she smiled, knowing that I had more and obviously wanting her complete fantasy to be fulfilled. I decided i would let this hot little thing give me a few commands, as she would be taking a few from me shortly. I moved over to the tank. I plunged the nozzle in my belly button once again and reached up to turn the valve. The rush of the magic gas into my body was amplified this time, and my body began to bulge much faster than it had before. I thought that it must be the mass i already had making the growth happen instantly this time. The bottom of my tank top was drapped over the hose, and it began to slide up towards my waist as the tanks stretched around my body. I looked down to see my chest pushing outward, the gap between my pecs deepening as the skin stretched around them once more. I looked over at Kristen and smiled widely, as she was already doing the same.

She pushed back her dark brown hair as her bright greenish-blue eyes sparkled. This girl was definetly a site to be seen, but having this sort of fantasy made her even more attractive. She slid her hands down her legs as she licked her lips, obviously getting turned on watching me grow.

My arms were now being pushed away from my torso as my lats widened and my biceps and triceps inflated. The tingle spread all over my body, and was intesifying with each passing second, as my muscles continued their growth. I flexed my arms and chest once more, feeling the rush of power to them as the bulged slightly bigger than the rest of me, and continued the growth once i stopped, but slightly ahead of the rest of me. I smiled as i realized what happened, and squeezed my abdominal muscles hard.

The gas seemed to become concentrated on my stomach as i flexed it, and the tingle became stronger as i felt them fill with extra size. Kristen noticed what i had done, and made her way over to me to get a closer look!

"Nice 8-PACK!" she cooed as she rubbed my stomach, each muscle now inhumanly large and cut. Her eyes wandered all over my body as she finally came to rest on my face, now looking up higher as i grew taller. My extra large pecs pushed the straps of my shirt further out in front of me, now lifting away from my collar bone as my pecs and traps pushed outward around it. The definition was already unbelievable, and now i was becoming insanely cut. I reached up and twisted the valve open even more as my tank stretched to almost full capacity on my massive torso, and my legs were getting much too big for my once-roomy shorts. I felt my legs finally touch each other as they billowed with power. I stepped out a little to allow more room, as my big muscle jock frame was slowly transforming into that of a well-seasoned body builder. Pounds of muscle piled on each second, and the wandering hands of my admirer grabbing on for the ride. I could feel my torso lengthen and widen as the tank top neared it's limit, the seams now being pulled apart slowly.

"RRRRRRIIIIIIIIIPPPPPPP!!" A long tear cut through the back of the shirt as it submitted to my expanding lats and shoulders. The fabric hugged tight around my waist as it crept to the broader portion below my chest. And WOW what a chest it was. Every single vein feeding power into their meaty, bulging forms was now visible through the shirt. They widened and pushed their way around the tank top, now popping through the arm holes obcenely. A quick FLEX caused the straps around my shoulders to POP! as the plates of muscle atop my chest were revealed in all their glory. i reached up and gripped the waist of the shirt, tearing it off with not an ounce of effort. My shorts were also nearing breaking point as my legs grew with size.

I had to bend my neck to peer at them over my pecs, but looking at Kristen's face also told me what was happening. THe leg holes of the shorts had been slowly creeping up my leg and tearing apart at the seams, revealing the deepening striations of my quadriceps. Oaks were slowly becoming redwoods as they lengthened and thickened with each pump of blood infusing them with the magic vapors. My shoes quickly went from uncomfortably small to leather shrapnel as another loud RRRRRIIIIPPPP filled the room. A reach to my crotch and another effortless pull revealed my body-builder physique in all of it's glory. The posing strap held firmly around my giant cock and balls, but the straps were stretched thin around my waist and bulging ass. I let the gas seep into me for a few more seconds before shutting of the valve.

At least 50 more pounds of muscle were added to my body, giving me the build of a seasoned competitor, but much more filled out and hunky. I bounced my pecs as Kristen's hands made their way back to them, and she groaned with pleasure as their rock-hard forms filled her palms. "That was fuckin'..HOT!" she sighed, almost drooling at the sight of my well developed body. She followed my naked chest and abs down to my waist, and the bulge that sat between my hips. It began to quiver as her warm hands grazed over it, and the fabric began to writhe and creak.

"You're not to bad yourself, baby!" I boomed as i gripped her ass with my giant hands and lifted her face to mine and her feet over a foot off the ground. She immediatly wrapped her own strong legs around my waist, and continuned to fondle my chest, grabbing my nipples and licking her lips with anticipation. My cock jumped outward as it got hard, causing the stretching fabric to finally SNAP and flutter to the floor. My oversized man meat had to be bigger than anyone else's in the world, almost a foot long and super thick when soft, I could only imagine how big it'd be hard. As blood pumped into it and it began to point skyward, I felt it begin to wedge itself between the fit brunette's ass cheeks. She immediatly leaned back and pulled off her top, exposing her nice musular build and bulging busoms. She kicked her legs up as she sat on my dick, now fully hard and strong enough to support her weight. My now free hands reached up to pull her shorts off. She slid up and down the length of my mighty penis and finally jumped off of the end of it, leaving her warm pussy juice on its entire length. She stuck her finger into her cunt as she gripped the shaft, only going halfway around it with her fingers. She dropped to her knees and pushed the end of the tip in her mouth, swirling it with her tongue and sliding her hand up and down the length.

I just stood there enjoying the ecstasy as i scanned over my new body one more time. The sight of all the overgrown muscle was topped only by the sexy face attached to my cock, giving it her all. She groaned and moaned as she was enjoying it as much as I was. She reached up and began to massage her breast with the free hand. I grinned down at her as I flexed my cock. It startled her slightly as it pushed it's way a little deeper into her mouth, but she grinned sexily back up at me.

"Oh, baby!! You're my fuckin' fantasy! Your big muscles make me soooo... hot!" She rose to her feet and peered deep at me with the biggest bedroom eyes. She laid back on my bed and began to massage her pussy lips again.

"FUCK ME, DADDY!! PUT THAT BIG COCK IN ME AND FUCK ME RAW!!" She begged loudly, breathing deeply and almost commanding me.

"You're a sexy little bitch, you know that?" I gave it back to her as she grinned at me. I gripped my cock and stroked it hard as i neared orgasm from the awesome power and the worship i was receiving. I flexed my cock hard as I commanded it to spew, and it shot a healthy load all over her tits and tight belly. I rubbed it in as she moaned and wiggled around on my bed.

"OH, YEAH!!" she yelled.

I stood back for a moment with my cock still erect and placed my hands on my hips. "Am i big enough for you NOW?" i growled at her while she continued to rub her tits and lick the cum off of her fingers.

"Youre fuckin' Massive!! And so... damn... UGHN!!!! HOT!!!" she pushed her finger deep into her cunt as she also seemed to will out more juice, leaking out on to my bed. "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!!" she arched her back and squeeled as she creamed big time, like she'd been saving up for this exact encounter, training herself to cum in worship of whatever muscle man she might get with. I could tell she worked her body both inside and out, her tight pussy lips contracting as she squeezed out a few more drops of her woman-cum.

I pushed the head of my cock against the opening of her snatch, and flexed it hard again as i slid it slowly into her. the walls of her pussy seemed to stretch around my cock while her lips hugged it tight, but still allowed it through. I had half of the 16" length of it inside her, and slid it back out as she moaned again!

"AAH!! OH YEAH!" was all she could muster from her quivering lips as i pushed deeper into her on my second thrust, feeling the length get squeezed by her own well-developed musculature. she pushed her legs up into the air as she tried to work my cock to her g-spot, and found it with the loudest moan yet. "MM! RIGHT THERE! FUCK ME WITH THAT BIG MUSCLE DICK!! MMM!!"

i wrapped one of my hands around her firm waist as i grabbed one of her legs with the other, i gripped her body like a fuck toy and began to thrust faster and deeper, finally hitting the deepest part of her cunt and pushing a little harder. she wrapped her legs around my waist again and pulled my in and out in rhythm to my thrusts, groaning on each one. I flexed my cock hard, and felt her cunt tighten as it grew inside her.

"AAAAAHH!!" she yelled in pain as i increased the size of my member, thichening it and pushing it deeper into her dripping pussy. Her whole body shook as her orgasm finally gave way, seeping warm cum all over my cock and down my crotch. She moaned and grunted more, and finally went limp, breathing hard and rubbing her own nipples. I pulled her off of my cock and laid her on the bed, smiling at my accomplishment.

"oh, fuck!!" she was in heaven, She continuned to rub herself up and down as i willed my supercharged cock to a flacid state. I pulled the strap back around it and found that the added size made it also near breaking point.

"This cock is too big for such a little amount of muscle, wouldn't you say? I need to go 'workout' some more." Stressing the fact that the task of adding size to my body took very little effort. She was done easing out of her extasy and looked up to give my another sexy grin.

"My boyfriend doesn't have a cock that big! But his muscles are way bigger!" Boyfriend? it only made sense for someone who looked that good, but BIGGER THAN ME!! he must have been a super-heavyweight bodybuilder.

"Does he compete?" my tone slowly changed gears.

"No, but..." she looked at the clock. "He should be at the gym right about now! I say we go over there so i can dump him!" I knew she was implying her lust over a far superior man, soon to be anyway.

"I say we have a little fun with him first! Let's go!"

She grabbed her clothes and eagerly replaced them. She grabbed my shoulders and jumped up to give me a kiss. "He's not as tall as you, either." Fuck-me eyes returned as she grabbed one of the XXL shirts i had just purchased. I pushed it over my sizeable torso, and did the same with a pair of spandex shorts that hugged my well-developed legs nicely. I grabbed my car keys, and we were headed back to the gym!!

[CanadianGordon]

Nice story. Mostly ignored the female parts, but loved the worshipping and the growing. Hope he's gonna fuck the soon to be ex bf!

[Mad Dog]

Fantastic!

[muscleboytom]

Awesome story! How about giving kristen a shot of that muscle growth gas before they head back to the gym...LOL

Muscleboytom

[built_spill]

Sure, why not a little female muscle growth, if only in the interest of fairness.

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by built_spill

Sure, why not a little female muscle growth, if only in the interest of fairness.

Because the site is about "male muscle growth" as it says in the header?

We've had this discussion before. There are already sites online that deal with that topic, and this one has been (dare I say is) about male muscle growth.

[Xyggurat]

Originally Posted by Corwin

Because the site is about "male muscle growth" as it says in the header?

We've had this discussion before. There are already sites online that deal with that topic, and this one has been (dare I say is) about male muscle growth.

Not to start a battle of words or anything, but let the guy write about what inspires him. The site's about male muscle growth, true, but we have stories where no one grows. We have tales that involve aliens, symbiotes, magic, etc. and with plots beyond the bare bones requirements of the site.

I don't see anything wrong with the author taking license. In fact, I do think there's something wrong when we tell people that a subject in good taste (okay, taste as good as anything else on a site primarily dedicated to erotica) is forbidden, so long as the basic qualifications are met.

-X-

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

I don't see anything wrong with the author taking license. In fact, I do think there's something wrong when we tell people that a subject in good taste (okay, taste as good as anything else on a site primarily dedicated to erotica) is forbidden, so long as the basic qualifications are met.

Discussing the purpose of this site and what this site is about is more than "a battle of words".

I have no problems with an author taking license, as I have said in the past. The author is certainly free to write such a story, and put that story on a site that deals with that topic. That site is not this site. This site is about male muscle growth.

[BB-61]

Finally! A heterosexual story! While I know that most everyon on this board does not get off on heterosexual sex, there is a sizable audience here for that stuff.

jpmuscle is on the right track as far as I'm concerned, why can't we just let him be who he is?

jp, if you are taking a poll though, it seems to me that Kristen will need a 'little' growth just to be able to take such a massive cock.

And for those who claim that there are a lot of sites out there for giant men and little ladies... please give me the links... becuase I sure can't find them!

[CanadianGordon]

If the story heads the way I think it will, the guy will dump the girl for her ex bf.
If it doesn't... I'm writing a rewrite!

[theseventhwave]

Woo! Corwin and Xyggurat (my two favourite authors) posting back-to-back - how cool is that?

Yes - this site is about "male muscle growth" - but that's vague. If that were all that this site was about, then there would be no "erotic" stories of any kind. Hence, I am willing to cover my eyes at the occasional hetero-sex scene if it means that my senses are overwhelmed by the wonderful (super-hot) erotic writings (i.e. by Corwin and Xyggurat, etc.) that we usually find here on this site.

Original and interesting and well written muscle growth stories are rare gems (unless you know something that I don't) - and so I am thankful for what I can get. For this particular chapter of Massium, I just substituted a male for the female and let my crazy imagination run amok. I have to admit that I also occasionally go to the "Diana The Valkyrie" website - again, covering my eyes for any hint of hetero-sex (ick!) - although I am not into female growth, I have to admit that there are a few authors there who craft interesting, original, and well written stories (i.e. character development, plot, psychological tension, and muscle growth where you also get the perspective of the person who is being "out-grown" or having his muscles stolen by the "grower" - mmm so hot!).

Instead of having this banter, let's just all allow this to be an "open" community and the rest of you (i.e. Xyggurat and Corwin and jpmuscle) GET BACK TO WRITING!



Love you all!

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by theseventhwave

Woo! Corwin and Xyggurat (my two favourite authors) posting back-to-back - how cool is that?

Yes - this site is about "male muscle growth" - but that's vague. If that were all that this site was about, then there would be no "erotic" stories of any kind.

That does not necessarily follow. Some of us obviously find muscle growth erotic, and that shows up in the stories. Whether heterosexual or gay or whatever, the forum seems to agree that such stories are all OK, adopting your reasoning.

The issue, as I see it, is whether stories involving "Female muscle growth" are apporpriate for a site dedicated to "male muscle growth". I say no. Take them to http://www.thevalkyrie.com or other such sites and keep this one to its purpose.

[BB-61]

Well, I'm not so sure Corwin.

The trouble with http://www.thevalkyrie.com is that it's more for amazons fantasies.

The trouble with some of the female muscle growth sites you might be thinking about is that it put the women in a dominant role. i.e. giantesses and the like.

What I have not found, and I would spend all my time on if it existed... is a site where men dominate with muscle growth, the sex is heterosexual (I personally prefer even over bisexual protaganists) ... and a little female growth is OK so long as the male remains dominant.

These are my tastes, but I am giving voice to them.

I even don't mind a female grwoing to amazon proportions that dominates other men... so long as the lead male is even bigger and dominates her.

By now you might wonder why I don't write my own, and then answer is that it's hard to surprise myself when I write my own stuff.

I have asked before in the stories archive to have a code to denote a heterosexual story... that way you can bypass it, and I can specifically filter to find it.

Like you, I read the homosexual stuff, and have to 'scroll past' the homosexual sex just to get back to the muscle growth. My favorite story on the archive is "Sugar Packets" because it's heavy on the growth and light on the sex ... though it's pretty obvious the characters are homosexual.

Corwin, it seems to me that you are not happy that heterosexual content has found its way to this site, is this the sort of tollerecne that homosexuals generally practice?

Don't I have a right to my own hard on? Is it my fault I was born heterosexual?

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by BB-61

Corwin, it seems to me that you are not happy that heterosexual content has found its way to this site, is this the sort of tollerecne that homosexuals generally practice?

Don't I have a right to my own hard on? Is it my fault I was born heterosexual?

You are very wrong, and I'd ask you to provide any evidence of anything I have said negative about heterosexual sex or content. If you can't, please apologize.

Someone asked for "female muscle growth". That is simply not the purpose of this site. That is simply a fact. It is not a slander in any way, shape or form of heterosexuals.

If no such site exists, feel free to create one, but this site is not it. And trying to turn this into a "heterosexuals are so oppressed here" thread is a strawman argument and disgusts me.

[giantw]

I think the female-muscle growth might be better suited elsewhere, but this is just my opinion.

Jpmuscle,

Great work on this story so far. Although I am not straight, I find the scenes of muscle growth and domination to be equally as suggestive and pleasing as any such scene where the protagonists are gay. I think you're doing a tremndous job with this...you've sparked this much debate, so clearly you're on the right track

Take care,

btw, how big is the main character now (stats)? Some of us are sticklers for this...

[Mdlftr]

Corwin, BB-1,

Cool your jets, guys!

This story contains male muscle growth--and that's the ONLY kind of muscle growth we've seen so far.

The difference is that the sex has been explicit---and heterosexual, for a change.

So what's the big deal? Each of you just "blip" over the parts you don't like, and go on from there!

What might/should/shouldn't happen is irrelevant. Don't go getting all in a self-righteous snit over woulda/coulda/shoulda/oughta...

Life's too short for imaginary slights---enjoy the good times (like this muscle growth story and others on the site) and save the fights for the real problems!

My two refereeing cents,

Mdlftr

[BB-61]

Yea, I was afraid of that....

I didn't really intend to write in a way that sounded like a flame.
All I was hoping to do is let jpmuscle know that I like what he has written... it's rarely found on this site, and it will keep me reading and re-reading the story.

But I reall do not understand the opposition to female muscle growth if male muscle growth also exists in the story.

For example, I love to go to bearchive.com which is principally about female Breast Enlargement. Nobody ... and I mean nobody has opposed a story that also contains male muscle growth and/or penis enlargement.

So I'm scratching my head here trying to figure out why jpmuslce is getting any flak at all for having written heterosexual content.

Maybe if his writing is not welcome here, the bearchive.com or overflowingbra.com is the place to continue the story.... though he may have to thow a bone to that audience and put a little BE into it.


As for your apology Corwin,
I don't see where one is warranted as I never insulted you, and I said "It seems" in my interpretation of your posts.
Yes I was reading into it. And I prefaced my observation so that you know I knew I was being asumptive.

I was just seeking clairity.
May I ask you directly, if jpmuscle chooses on his own to write some female muscle growth will you recommend he write somewhere else from that point on?

What are you trying to achive by pointing out that this is a male muscle growth site? (a fact obvious to most, now that you've pointed out that it's in the header.)

IT SEEMS .... (note that's assumptive) that you are attempting to prohibit the posting of female muscle growth in a story on this site ... even though the story is principally centered on male muscle growth.

I appreciate that this site is free to the public but it is being hosted at someone else's expense, and allow me to be a little lazy here... I haven't checked to see if you are one of the owners of the site.

If it is comming out of your pocket, then I will shut up from here on out, because I agree that you have a right to control the content of your own site.

If, corwin, you are not an owner, then I will continue to defend the liberty of heterosexual content. If the conception of this site was that it is to be exclusively gay, then why not indicate that in the header?

[roodinverse]

To jpmuscle: Massium 2 - terrific sequel / reinterpretation of Massium 1. More, more, more, please!

To Corwin and BB-61: So far, jpmuscle is catering DIRECTLY to this site's audience -- men (and possibly a very few women, as this is the semi-anonymous internet) who are into huge muscular men. "Into" being a catchall preposition covering everything from mild fascination to deep erotic fantasy.

I'm going to be a bit presumptuous and give a few guesses about the story and I ask jpmuscle to forgive me. The main subject of this story is, and will likely continue to be, men getting larger and more muscular using the Massium gas. There is heterosexual sex, and it is not gratuitous considering the medium (note: this is an erotic story). There may be SOME female muscle growth as well, and as long as it doesn't play a major part in the story (as in lengthy descriptions of her growth and new body/abilities), and it "makes sense" (he's too big, she expands to accommodate) I see no problem. Corwin, I think you're right to object about story content in general, but I think you read too much into that particular post. BB-61, I think YOU'RE right as well to defend heterosexual content, seeing as this site is only predominantly gay (woohoo!), and not exclusively (though I'd have to ask Flexodus about that).

Also, I think you're both making a huge deal about something that has not even happened in this case (a story starting off on the right foot and crossing the line to something completely different and entirely off-topic). So, you know, guys, relax and enjoy a new batch of stories.

To BB-61 specifically: One joy in writing these kinds of stories is coming up with an interesting fantasy (even if it's not totally original) that turns you on, and then sharing it. So, you can't surprise yourself. Big deal. Put it out there and maybe it'll encourage someone else. The internet has metric tons of proof that there's always at least 10 other people who like EXACTLY what you do. I've been banging away at something for a bit that I may, one day, have the courage to post.

To Corwin specifically: your stories kick so much arse it's not even funny. Thank you for writing.

--rood

[muscleboytom]

Sorry to have caused such a tempest. Will keep my opinions to myself from now on.

Thanks for the great story jpmuscle and please keep writing.

Muscleboytom

[jpmuscle]

WOW!!! All i can say is WOW! I didn't think i would kick up this much dust with my story!!! I thought about a little, but all this publicitiy could make a girl go Hollywood on this site.... To bad I'm a guy! The measurements are at the begining of part 5, which i'm in the process of writing. It's funny you should mention stats because I love them as well, and added them shortly after I started writing the story for anyone who might like it. I'm already a step ahead of you, giantw!!

As far as female muscle growth goes, i am looking to put in a little bit, just so the girl can accomidate the cock(s) being inserted into her. I think giving her ex-boyfriend something to be jealous of wouldn't hurt either.

I respect the opinions and the mythology behind this website, and do not plan on making the female growth gratuitous in any way. Just a little to move the story along. I'm still on the fence about whether or not the ex-boyfriend should grow, and I'll decide once i get back to writing. I should have part 5 up in a day or two.

Thanks to all of you who are supporting my work. I'm really starting to feel comfortable around the gay population of this site (you mean I'M a minority!) Off topic a bit here, I do support the overall strive for well-being and acceptance, and can't stand all of these closed minded politicians skewing the realities of sexuality for their own causes. Thanks for accepting me and other hetero's on your board.

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by BB-61

So I'm scratching my head here trying to figure out why jpmuslce is getting any flak at all for having written heterosexual content.

jpmuslce isn't getting any flak. Your really need to read the whole thread in context. muscleboytom and built_spill (who should know better), both of whom suggested female muscle growth, are simply being reminded that this is a site for MALE muscle growth.

Originally Posted by BB-61

Maybe if his writing is not welcome here, the bearchive.com or overflowingbra.com is the place to continue the story.... though he may have to thow a bone to that audience and put a little BE into it.


As for your apology Corwin,
I don't see where one is warranted as I never insulted you, and I said "It seems" in my interpretation of your posts.

It seems to me that you have some severe reading compression problems. The history of this thread speaks for itself. No one is criticizing either this story nor its author. I am not criticizing the heterosexual content, nor would I ever do that. Yet, you seem to think different. Why is that

Originally Posted by BB-61

If, corwin, you are not an owner, then I will continue to defend the liberty of heterosexual content.
If the conception of this site was that it is to be exclusively gay, then why not indicate that in the header?

If you think "female muscle growth" is the same as "heterosexual content", you have some serious problems.

[Sanitarium87Q]

I believe that the main thing in question here is why can't there be female muscle growth in the story when there is clearly male muscle growth as it is? The site is for male muscle growth, but why not having female muscle growth coexisting in one story? What is the worst that could happen if the author of this story, God forbid, puts female muscle growth in the story? If what you all are afraid of is attracting a different kind of audience that might "take over the site" or something, then surely you must know that could never happen.

And no offense, but it's pretty ignorant for someone to say that someone else has "serious problems" just because they are incorrect about something.

[Mad Dog]

There's already a story in the archive that has muscle growth in both genders (Kowalski's "A New World Order"). I don't see the fuss.

[teen muscle]

I havent been on this site for long and no one really knows me but why not put my opion in this conversation

I compleatly agree with Sanitarium87Q and there are some bysexual people on this site or people who just have muscle fettishes ((forgive my spelling))

and if you dont like it dont read it personaly I like the story and however it turns out is fine since it is the authors work and he has his own freedom to write what he wants

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Sanitarium87Q

I believe that the main thing in question here is why can't there be female muscle growth in the story when there is clearly male muscle growth as it is? The site is for male muscle growth, but why not having female muscle growth coexisting in one story? What is the worst that could happen if the author of this story, God forbid, puts female muscle growth in the story? If what you all are afraid of is attracting a different kind of audience that might "take over the site" or something, then surely you must know that could never happen.

That may be, but what I was reacting to was the specific request for female muscle growth here. There are already sites that deal with that, as I have pointed out.

Originally Posted by Sanitarium87Q

And no offense, but it's pretty ignorant for someone to say that someone else has "serious problems" just because they are incorrect about something.

It is pretty ignorant to raise the argument about how persecuted straight people are, and to use my statements to make grand claims about the gayness of this site. You're right -- he was wrong. He failed to admit that and failed to apologize for it even when asked. That's ignorant too.

[Corwin]

here's one of the first times this argument has come up

It's exactly the same argument. In fact, some of the same people are involved.

and again

I can't help but wonder if some people are trolling for this argument, since they admit in their prior posts that the site is for "male muscle growth" but keep raising this issue over and over and over again.

[JulianFox]

Love the story! Good work.

I can go on and on about why I like this one, and because it was terrific, I think I will.

1) The main character is confident but not a jerk.

The best muscle growth stories have been ones where the grower is a "Kermit the Frog" type: his personality is so mute you can project just about any trait you want on him.

I don't know about you guys, but I don't care about Random Guy #37 growing muscle, I like to imagine ME growing.

Some traits, like Jerkiness, get in the way of putting oneself in the character's shoes. If you don't like them, it's hard to be happy for them when they grow.

No offense intended to some of the absolutely wonderful writers on this forum, who I am the biggest fan of, but if a story has the word "Jock" in the title, I'm probably not going to read it.

2) The story had muscle worship.

Sure, EVERYBODY'S got sex, but muscle worship, that's something else - that's your partner getting into a crazy wild bobcat sex frenzy because you're such a STUD. Who wouldn't want that? What's the point of muscles if you don't have somebody to oil you down?

As for the whole heterosexual muscle debate, despite being a heterosexual that writes stories with heterosexual characters, I have to agree with that one dude that said this isn't the most appropriate forum for female muscle growth.

Though here's the thing: this guy can put in his stories whatever he pleases.

C'mon, let's face it, guys: with a fetish like muscle growth that is almost hilariously implausible sounding to most people (not that there's anything wrong with that) your odds are a little higher than normal of having a few other kinks.

I remember a while back there was a furry muscle growth story on this site. I'm not into that sort of thing. If you don't like furry, don't read that one story. If you DO like furry. . .

The Evolution Archive's got your back.

[Kyrosan]

I just thought I'd drop a comment about the story. I LOVE the muscle growth as well as the cock growth. While I'm not all that interested in reading about women growing in stories, I do not see a problem with it, as long as the male muscle growth is predominant. Yes, this may be a "male muscle growth" site, but sometimes you can only stretch reality so far (i.e. a woman's anatomy can only handle so much). So basically, as long as the female growth is used mainly to allow the story to continue and give the fictions some semblance of reality, what's the problem?

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Kyrosan

So basically, as long as the female growth is used mainly to allow the story to continue and give the fictions some semblance of reality, what's the problem?

The problem is that it is a slippery-slope argument.

The site is called "Male muscle growth forums". It is not "muscle growth forums". It is "male muscle growth forums." The male is important.

Who decides what is "predominant" or not? Is it 10%? 20%? 50%? Will a story that is about a female character with muscle growth be allowed if there is some male muscle growth? I can hear the argument now -- "well, there is male muscle growth in the story, so it should be allowed." After all, that is the argument people are using right now -- female muscle growth should be allowed it there is male muscle growth. I disagree.

If female muscle growth is allowed, it really changes, in a very fundamental way, the realities of this website. The fact that there may already be such a story really doesn't justify the argument.

What people are arguing really comes down to this -- there is no other website that people know about that allows for any gender muscle growth. Therefore, we should allow that here, even though this is a website for male muscle growth. In my mind, that is usurping the mission of this group under a false pretense. If there are people interested in any gender muscle growth, they have options. They can create a yahoo group. They can buy their own website. Basically taking over this site is akin to theft.

That is the problem.

[Xyggurat]

I should be writing rather than posting, but I'll try anyway.

There are a number of stories on Diana the Valkyrie that feature male muscle growth that is subordinate to the female muscle growth. That does not mean that I want to go surfing through Diana the Valkyrie or any other website for good stories when we have a perfectly good one right here.

However, the argument's kind of a moot point: authors on this forum are going to write in whatever they see as being fit, and unless it's seriously, ethically wrong, there's not much you can do to stop them. I think we need to start focusing on what we, ourselves, do rather than try to stop others from doing what they enjoy. I think, honestly, that the only requirement for a site about "male muscle growth" should be that the stories do feature some form of male muscle growth.

If there are other things going on, that's just part of the plot.

-X-

I've tried to stay out of this one but it's getting interesting. This site is and has been primarily male muscle growth with a gay theme since it's inception. Forums do drift and without periodic course corrections the vehicle will be wrecked on the shores of chaos. This discussion is a wake up call for course correction again.

Although "gay" is not stated in the forum title, it is very prominent in the stories and images presented here for years. Straight men have every right to read and contribute and the mention of people of the female persuasion now and then isn't offensive, they are however, not the thrust or goal of this forum. "Male" is the operative word here.

Web forums are not a democratic institution. First of all they are monitored (wise monitors however usually stay inconspicuous until their omnipotent hand is forced). Secondly, fervent members of a forum gallantly defend the status-quo against usurpers who would incrementally run the ship onto the rocks.

Themes outside the norms tend to rock the boat and there is a strong group of members here who really don't want to see the boat rocked. Just as some straight men have mentioned that they don't like the gay sex scenes, I and many others here find straight sex just as unpalatable. Themes outside the norms would probably be better served in the long run if posted at different forums.

I've said it before and I'll keep on saying it as long as it's true. Despite the unusual direction of this forum, it is one of the best of it's type. It's HUGE, it's polite, it's literate, it has a long established consistent theme, the contributors are talented and sophisticated. This is a very good and sucessful forum. I for one want to keep it so. Amazons go home!

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

However, the argument's kind of a moot point: authors on this forum are going to write in whatever they see as being fit, and unless it's seriously, ethically wrong, there's not much you can do to stop them. I think we need to start focusing on what we, ourselves, do rather than try to stop others from doing what they enjoy. I think, honestly, that the only requirement for a site about "male muscle growth" should be that the stories do feature some form of male muscle growth.

I mostly agree with L.G. and disagree to some extent with the above. There is more at issue here than the rights of the writer. There are also the rights of the forum participants. Some thousands of people have joined this forum expecting "male muscle growth". These rights can be in conflict, and it is ethically wrong to totally ignore the rights of the forum participants.

Several years ago, the archives of this forum were shut down when one person complained about pedophilia. At the time, many of us pointed out that fictional stories, as original creative works, enjoy strong first amendment protections (as opposed to photography where a real model is involved). Even so, there has been some discussion about the use of children in stories, the legalities involved, the rights of writers and the rights of the readers. Xyggurat totally ignores the rights of the thousands of forum participants that found this site expecting "male muscle growth."

There are several differences between the current issue and the issue of underage children in stories. First, the issue then involved only male children. Also, there is no question that stories with females above the age of consent is valid legally. But, like before, there are the expectations of the forum readers, many of whom were uncomfortable with the use of underage children. At the time, rather than try and impose some rule on writers or face the prospect of a legal investigation, the archives were simply removed for several months.

A rule that the use of minor children is prohibited is easily articulated. The people arguing for female muscle growth have no such consistent rule. They have used the word "predominantly" and even "some". They argue about the rights of writers and ignore the rights of the readers. People who find this site are clearly told it is about "male muscle growth". In fact, googling "male muscle growth" (in quotes) leads to this site. The rule, "no female muscle growth" is both easily understood and easily enforced. It does not lead to confusion about how much female muscle growth is allowed, whether it is "some" or "predominantly". How other sites resolve this issue is interesting, but imposing no requirements on how the issue is resolved here.

As L.G. points out, drift is a problem. By voluntarily adopting rules based upon the stated purpose of the group, we can avoid drift. Failing to adopt such rules, or allowing a free-for-all where writers can do whatever they please has the risk that the forum owner becomes disenchanted with the group and shuts it down.

Just to be clear, as I have said before, this is not an issue about "gay" vs "straight". Women worshipping male muscle growth and intercourse between men and women are consistent with this group. What is inconsistent is either writing about, or encouraging others to write about, female muscle growth.

[Xyggurat]

Originally Posted by Corwin

Xyggurat totally ignores the rights of the thousands of forum participants that found this site expecting "male muscle growth."

All right. Statements like that are just silly. This isn't a debate class, and rather than get irritated, this will be my last post on the matter.

I don't mean to demean your argument, but... come *on.* There are no implicit rights here. The site says that it's about male muscle growth. I admit that one expects to find male muscle growth here. As for my ignoring that: I've stated that stories posted on these forums, by nature, must include male muscle growth.

It's not in your realm of influence to order vehement reprisals against anyone who includes elements beyond male muscle growth in their stories. Extraneous elements are what make stories unique. If you *just* want male muscle growth, every single story would be fundamentally the same and oh-so-boring. I can't speak for others, but I'd get bored if *all* that happened in these stories was some guy growing huge.

Beyond this argument, who is going to moderate what is 'acceptable' fiction for this archive? You? And who decides what is 'acceptable'? What would the qualifications for either job be?

There are, in my eyes, two plausible choices:

1) This forum becomes heavily moderated, and all stories are subject to deletion if someone finds a portion or theme offensive. (See also: Xyggurat leaving.)

2) People who are offended realize that they don't have the right to foist rules on others. Unless one submits, by choice, to rules, the only governance that exists here is by moderators and our own good taste. (Ironic, on an erotic forum.) I've read some stories I didn't like. What worked for me? Use of the "Next Thread" button, which, despite its humble beginnings, is extremely effective for clearing your screen of offensive material.

-X-

[Mdlftr]

This debate is getting interesting!

Still, I must say Xyggurat takes this round, and, in my opinion, the argument.

This forum is moderated enough to avoid prosecution, and keep it interesting.

Everything we talk or fantasize about on here is someone's opinion of what THEY think is within the limits here. If people don't like it, they can *blip* over it.

The "thought police" are STILL only on "Star Trek"!


Mdlftr

[Sanitarium87Q]

I couldn't agree more with what Xyggurat has said. He couldn't be any more correct.

What bothers me most, however, is that this topic, in my opinion, has gone far beyond where it should have stopped. It really shouldn't have started. I've been thinking about this, but now I'll actually say that I fear that with all of this controversy, the author of Massium 2.0 will probably not even want to continue with the story. And I couldn't blame him. All I can do at this point is hope that this story continues.

Also, I hope people actually read and try to understand Xyggurat's post, and instead of simply trying to be difficult and looking for a way to argue, maybe it's best to concede.

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

I don't mean to demean your argument, but... come *on.* There are no implicit rights here.

There are rights everywhere. You yourself talked about the author being able to write what they want ("authors on this forum are going to write in whatever they see as being fit"). That is a right. However, there is also the expectations of the readers. That is a right too. Your denying that these things exist is insincere at best.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

The site says that it's about male muscle growth. I admit that one expects to find male muscle growth here. As for my ignoring that: I've stated that stories posted on these forums, by nature, must include male muscle growth.

and I have never denied that. But you also state that it being male need not be a defining characteristic -- that female muscle growth can be the main purpose of a post as long as there is some male muscle growth ("that the stories do feature some form of male muscle growth.")

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

It's not in your realm of influence to order vehement reprisals against anyone who includes elements beyond male muscle growth in their stories.

I have done no such thing. I have said one element, female muscle growth, is a slippery slope that has the ability to change the very nature of this forum. Female is not male. THAT is the issue.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

Extraneous elements are what make stories unique.

Please show where I have spoken about elements in an abstract form? I have been quite explicit in talking about one element that is outside the bounds of this forum. This is not a discussion about abstractions allowed in stories. It is about one specific element -- the sex of the participants involved in the muscle growth.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

If you *just* want male muscle growth, every single story would be fundamentally the same and oh-so-boring. I can't speak for others, but I'd get bored if *all* that happened in these stories was some guy growing huge.

This is not my argument at all. Nor has it been yours. I have said, "The site is called 'Male muscle growth forums'. It is not 'muscle growth forums'. It is 'male muscle growth forums.' The male is important." You seem to agree: "I admit that one expects to find male muscle growth here." If that is the expectation, then there is no argument.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

Beyond this argument, who is going to moderate what is 'acceptable' fiction for this archive?

Obviously, as you state "one expects to find male muscle growth here." THAT is what is acceptable. As for any moderation, as has been pointed out, the owner always has the right to simply shut down the forum. Is that what you are advocating?

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

You? And who decides what is 'acceptable'? What would the qualifications for either job be?

So, is it acceptable to usurp the stated purpose of this group -- "male muscle growth" -- to make it be something else?

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

There are, in my eyes, two plausible choices:

1) This forum becomes heavily moderated, and all stories are subject to deletion if someone finds a portion or theme offensive. (See also: Xyggurat leaving.)

So, you are saying:
1) This forum should be a free-for-all, where female muscle growth stories are not only permitted but encouraged and should be the norm (see also: corwin leaving)

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

2) People who are offended realize that they don't have the right to foist rules on others.

And what rule would that be? That the stated purpose of this group is "male muscle growth"? That people who come here expect that? We seem to agree on that. Is that not a rule? Or, are you saying that the forum should really be a free-for-all where anything and everything goes? Yes, I do think that this forum, as its purpose states, is solely about "male muscle growth" and that allowing "female muscle growth" radically changes that purpose. Nothing you have said changes that. The word "male" is explictly not "female" and that distinction is not extraneous. Characterizing it as such is misguided and dishonest.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

Unless one submits, by choice, to rules, the only governance that exists here is by moderators and our own good taste. (Ironic, on an erotic forum.)

Are you saying that someone forced you to come here? That it was not your choice? That you had no knowledge that this forum is about "male muscle growth"? If it was your choice, and you knew the purpose of the group from the beginning, then you have accepted that as the rules. Advocating the theft of this group to some other purpose under the guise that the defining characteristic is "extraneous" and arguing against changing that defining characteristic is "offensive" belittles what people like about this group.

You apparently do know that the stated purpose of the forum is "male muscle growth", so apparently your rhetoric that we should drift beyond that purpose into "female muscle growth" is hyperbole.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

I've read some stories I didn't like. What worked for me? Use of the "Next Thread" button, which, despite its humble beginnings, is extremely effective for clearing your screen of offensive material.

I have never said "female muscle growth" is offensive. I have said it does not belong here.

Can you argue that it does belong here without misrepresenting what I have said?

[Corwin]

Originally Posted by Mdlftr

The "thought police" are STILL only on "Star Trek"!

This is not about thought police. It is about people interested in "male muscle growth" having a forum dedicated to that purpose. There are other forums where gender neutral muscle growth is permited. That is not here.

[CanadianGordon]

I'm getting very tired of hearing about this damn topic!

Fine. There are boundaries.

Good. Everyone needs boundaries.

Especially a site like this.

Maybe we need to state them clearer.

Now that that's been said. Can we please get back to the Muscle Growth?
The Male Muscle Growth already? Sheesh! This has gone on too long already.

[Mdlftr]

Originally Posted by Corwin

This is not about thought police. It is about people interested in "male muscle growth" having a forum dedicated to that purpose. There are other forums where gender neutral muscle growth is permited. That is not here[/b].

Au contraire.

Your position, as I understand it, is that NO stories on this forum should ever have any female muscle growth, at all, because it is not "male muscle growth". [Duh!]

Xyggurat says that this forum is primarily for male muscle growth and [I'm paraphrasing here] the female muscle growth, which is NOT the focus of the story, MAY be thrown in, for a little bit of variety.

Let's see:
Corwin: This forum is about Male muscle growth X - check
Xyggurat: This forum is about Male muscle growth X- check

Corwin: No female muscle growth EVER!!! THIS IS A BIG MAJOR DEAL!! X- check
Xyggurat: Female muscle growth, maybe, just to keep things interesting. X- check

What was the big argument about?
There's complete agreement here on the main focus of the forum.
There's disagreement about what is an acceptable MINOR detail in a POSSIBLE story that has not even been written yet!

Hmm...last time I checked, telling someone they're "wrong/disingenuous/ insincere at best/ misguided and dishonest" is not the way to persuade people as to the merits of your argument, AND,

---telling them they are "wrong" BEFORE they've done/said anything smacks of
"prior restraint" i.e. CENSORSHIP!!


Anyway... back to the muscle growth stories!

Mdlftr

[sexiscriptor]

Now, first of all, I probably have little right to jump into this Debate. Some of you have been following it religiously, voicing and defending your thoughts and opinions.

I, on the other hand, have only just entered this plenitude of posting. I'm not even a heavyweight around this forum--I haven't even made a serious posts with frequency in months.

Nevertheless, I wish to say something (for nothing comes from nothing). And I would hope that you would give me hear me out nonetheless, if only for the obvious effort I have put into this post.

First of all, the least I can say is: Everyone, chill! Some of the reactions I've read are visceral beyond warrant. In fact, some of you have voiced what approaches religious fervor over something as mundane as smut! Smut, I say!

I will not arbitrate what people on this forum can and cannot say; I do not believe that right is absolutely held by anyone. I will say that I think things must be kept in perspective.

I have on many occasions tried googling for other sites that carry male muscle growth stories, et alia; I can say, with certainty, that there really isn't all that much out there. This is pretty much it: even all the yahoo groups and mass archives (ie nifty) share at least 80% of the same stories as we have here in our archives.

Once, I thought I'd found a good source for new stories (new to me, at least): within a minute, I realized it was a subsection of Dianna the Valkyrie. Alright, I said, not usually my thing but perhaps this story or section is palatable; within a minute of that, of reading the first few paragraphs, I ascertained the nature of the story, and that it was not in fact my kind of story. Although dissapointed, I can at least say I gave it a pretty solid assessment.

Originally Posted by Xyggurat

There are a number of stories on Diana the Valkyrie that feature male muscle growth that is subordinate to the female muscle growth.

This is quite true; that was the nature of that story I was reading, as I discerned. Diana has a great resource of muscle growth stories; however, they are primarily female with occasional but always subordinate male growth.

I think this distinction is not unreasonable. It is very clear, as I recounted, when a particular path will be taken with muscle growth: there are two* fundamental kinds of people, men and women, ergo two paths for muscle growth, male and female.

I think it would detriment the Populi to ban or rule out all growth "deviant." Just as Diana the Valkyrie permits male growth, although stringent, I believe it will not destroy our forum to permit female growth.

There are several of you, however, who feel we will fall down some slippery slope, that the existence of even a minority of female growth will, as one respected forum member fears, "incrementally run the ship onto the rocks." Although unpalatable, straight sex is real: there is no stipulation of "gay" in the word "male."

I myself find the "hsmuscleboy" or however it's spelled "unpalatable;" in fact, I find those pictures grotesque and perverse. Nevertheless, in a recent discussion in the "Muscle Growth Photos & Images" section, I scolded a poster who decried "Sick! those are all fake and gross, get real!" I may not find those pictures enjoyable, but I can acknowledge that there are those of you who do--and that that fact is significant.

Likewise, female muscle growth exists, obviously--many have made mention of Diana the Valkyrie and other sites. We're obviously aware that it exists. This does not mean that it should usurp predominance from this site's male growth--nobody has ever said that. Nobody feels female growth should replace male growth on this site--that is madness even in my acknowledging! It already has a home elsewhere.

Nevertheless, female growth can, if a writer so desires, visit our site, as might a tourist, without damaging our site. Male growth has clearly been grounded here on our site; I don't think we have much to fear from a subordinate and infrequent existence of female growth because there are already sites dedicated to more intensely female growth stories--the demand is already met with a supply, and the equlibrium is satisfactory.

In conclusion, I think the reaction greeting a relatively benign issue (this story doesn't have female GROWTH--just female involvement!). Further, the intent and nature of this site--primarily concerned with male growth--is beyond redundant. We all understand that this site deals with male growth. Deviations thereof remain benign, however, because there are already existing sites for the other end of the spectrum; we will never see on this site the sorts of growth gracing the pages of Diana the Valkyrie. Besides, we are only talking about smut, folks. It's not like it even matters.

Let's face it: things could be a lot worse--thankfully, they never will be.

*Here I concede: there are more than two kinds of people; other 'kinds' include transexuals and hermaphrodites, those with sexual idenity disorder, eunichs and those otherwise 'deprived,' and all Catholic priests, nuns, and monks.