D.C. Marriage bill/ Equality March

[Ogun]

As you may know, David Catania (I- at large- DC) has introduced a bill to allow gay marriage in Dc and on October 11th there was an Equality March on the Mall, ending at the White House lawn and culminating in a 5-hour rally. PEOle from all over the U.S. came to march- I marched too. While many at the rally lambasted the president to act on his promise, others reminded us that change usually comes To Washington, not from it, and that individuals are important in creating that change. "This is a beginning, not an end." I hope that was not lost on those listening.

On personal note, my participation has inspired me to work on getting a Gay_Straight Alliance started at my college.
Did any of you pay attention to the march, or were any involved, and has it changed your perspective any?

[Mdlftr]

The week before the weekend of the march, I was on my way to the subway, when I stopped to chat with a guy who was wearing an "Equality" shirt, and soliciting signatures/donations.

Long story short: I have two very long term friends who are gay and in long-term, committed, exclusive, loving relationships. I have asked both of them whether, if they had the choice, they would "marry" their partner. Both of them sort of snorted and said, "Hell no" or the equivalent thereof. When I asked why, their response was, "What for?" I've got all the same civil rights and property sharing interests now."

One of these guys was married to a woman for five years, then divorced for ten years after that before he ever entered any gay relationships. I give him much more perspective than I have. If he doesn't feel it necessary, I guess I have to respect his opinion. When I said all this to the guy with the clipboard, he got all defensive and snarky, and accused my friends of being "wrong". My reaction is, "Hey, it's their lives. If they don't think the marriage issue is a big deal, I have to respect that." I personally think equal access to employment, services and insurance and child custody (all of which is happening across the U.S.) are more important issues. The Supreme Court has recognized that the state cannot criminalize consenting same sexual relationships, so, I think, eventually, it will all even out.

In the overall scheme of things, calling a state-recognized relationship a "marriage" pushes a lot of buttons: religious, social and cultural. A priest friend of mine said that in his opinion, the state should "get out of the marriage business" and only recognize / register "civil unions" for everyone. A marriage could then be an exclusively religious matter.

Some thoughts on a contentious issue....

Mdlftr

[wolfotehmoon]

The fact of the matter is that, in a lot of places, civil unions DON'T have the same protections that marriages do, and in some of the places that they DO, people are working to make sure that they don't. Separate-but-equal didn't work for schools, and it can't work for something so important to society as monogamous relationships. Whether we like it or not, the law makes a distinction between individuals and the units that marriage helps create, and it's not right to leave such an important right open to contention.

I'm personally very glad that DC is doing this.

[arpeejay]

Mdlftr:

I think your friends have a very odd perspective, one that's not borne out by the facts on the ground. Almost all the legal "protections" they reference are tenuous at best and easily challenged in court. And that's assuming they've *actually* put everything in place and don't encounter some officious asshole at a life critical moment, like the poor lesbian couple in Miami, one of whom (along with their children!) was denied access to her partner while she lay dying from a cerebral hemorrhage.

I was married to a woman, I have been in two long-term, committed relationships with men, and I can tell you without a doubt that the things straight married couples take for granted are things same sex couples have to work hard to achieve -- and then we get to pay taxes on them! Naoyuki is fortunate enough to work in a place with domestic partner benefits, which I will shortly be needing again, but the IRS considers what his institute spends on my health-care "untaxdd income" that he has to pay taxes on! Try selling THAT to straight married couples!

Marriage IS a civil institution, not a religious one. If people want to have a religious ceremony to bless their legally conjoined state, fine, but it's churches that need to get out of the marriage business, not the state.

xoxo

Richard

[Stoneman]

Hey remember when being gay used to be edgy or even kinda cool?

Back before we were just the neighbors?

[arpeejay]

Ya see, that's the thing...

I think people ought to get to decide whether they are edgy and cool or boring and ho hum; it ought to be OK for straight people to be edgy and cool and OK for gay people to be boring and ho hum. It ought to be OK for straight people to have hippy free love communes and for gay people to have marriages and kids and white picket fences.

The mistake is trying to make everyone edgy and cool OR trying to make everyone boring and ho hum. The point is to let people decide for themselves.

xoxo

Richard

[Ogun]

uh, yeah-
and on an individual basis, not as a group.

[Mdlftr]

Originally Posted by arpeejay

Ya see, that's the thing...

I think people ought to get to decide whether they are edgy and cool or boring and ho hum; it ought to be OK for straight people to be edgy and cool and OK for gay people to be boring and ho hum. It ought to be OK for straight people to have hippy free love communes and for gay people to have marriages and kids and white picket fences.

The mistake is trying to make everyone edgy and cool OR trying to make everyone boring and ho hum. The point is to let people decide for themselves.

xoxo

Richard

???? I thought we were already there! We have lesbian moms with kids on the local swim team, and nobody bats an eye. It's so routine here in the DC 'burbs ---this summer at our community picnic, I was chatting to two new male neighbors. They were a couple, so I mentioned the two other gay couples in the neighborhood, who were right down the street from them. One of the guys chuckled and said, "Oh, I thought we were pioneers here!"

Nope!

Mdlftr