The Chris Benoit Story (Venting)

b.spencer · #1 June 27th, 2007, 05:09 AM

(OK. I think I need to vent a little. I preface this by saying I have never used anything "illegal." Frankly, I don't know what my full potential is without using steroids yet.)

Anyone in the US who watched the morning shows, woke up to see that the murder-suicide of the WWE professional wrestler Chris Benoit and his family was automatically being blamed on a "roid rage." Just because there were steroids in his home. Never mind that this took place over three days, he left suicide notes for friends by text messaging, etc. No matter how premeditated it may have been, the 'roids made him do it.

HOW FUCKING STUPID CAN YOU BE.

How many of these things happen here in the US everyday that have nothing to do with drugs of any kind? How many of you have ever seen a "roid rage" that lasted for days and days and days? Anyone Benoit's age (40) who looked the way he did for as long as he did was most likely using. Most WWE guys are using , IMO. That doesn't make them or anyone else who uses a time bomb, a killer, a maniacal murder machine . . . anything other than a steroid user. The guys I know who use, and you guys here who do, are nothing more than good guys who what to look the best they can and who want to use every tool available. No more, no less.

The whole thing just makes me sick.

CelticMuscle · #2 June 27th, 2007, 12:09 PM

They mentioned the word "steroid" 135 times during a seven minute report. Clearly News Corp is a natural corporation!

redwolf64 · #3 June 27th, 2007, 12:09 PM

I knew someone would post on this one and, yes, I agree, the whole "roid rage" angle to this story is just that - a quick, sound-bite news angle.

Benoit had been having problems with his wife for some time - I believe she had filed for divorce a few months ago - and had other personal issues. It sounds more like a domestic situation gone bad more than anything else.

Is it just me or does it look like the WWE is being run more and more like a Hollywood studio would have been in the 1930s with Vince trying to be a Louis B. Mayer? It seems like the wrestlers that keep the shows going make decent money, but Vince and Company really looks at them as product without a lot of regard for their well being as employees and people.

wrestlejock646 · #4 June 27th, 2007, 07:38 PM

I totally agree with you guys...steroids are going to be blamed for Benoit's actions by just about everyone covering the story in the media. Is it just me, or did Benoit's intensity and personna make anybody else think he was always on the edge of snapping thoughout his career? I was shocked and saddened by these events, but not totally surprised by who was involved, if that makes any sense. I wonder what it is about pro-wrestling that SEEMS to result in so many tragic endings...

giantw · #5 June 27th, 2007, 11:32 PM

This post is sorely in need of someone to take the opposing viewpoint. I recognize there are many people on this site who condone and use steroids. I do not...Just so you know where I am coming from...I will say this:

1) The media is jumping the gun as no toxicological reports have come back on Benoit, and are not likely to for some time. Moreover, some of the steroids he was prescribed might have been to treat pain associated with the broken neck he suffered in 2000.

2) I do not believe this was an act of "roid rage." This is not to say that steroids may not have had an effect on Benoit. While the scene of the crime shows elements of premeditation (which argue strongly against insanity or rage defenses), he could have still planned and knowlingly carried out these crimes depressed. Those who abuse steroids often face serious bouts of depression when they come off a cycle. This may have led him to his altered state.

3) The number of tribute videos that I saw on Youtube for Benoit bothered me. Once it became apparent that Benoit murdered his familiy before comitting suicide, you would think the tribute videos would stop popping up. No. If anything they got more defensive. There were conspiracy theories. There was the argument that "we are honoring the wrestling persona, not the person". Others blamed the WWE for putting him under too much stress. The Benoit apologists refused to dethrone their idol because of all the years of entertainment he had given people. That is bullshit. That does not make him above the law and this sad state of affairs, while tragic, does not make him into a martyr worthy of tribute. So if Charles Manson had donned some wrestling tights and entertained crowds for 18 years, we'd see a tribute video for him? Come on...

4) I say all of the above knowing full well the investigation has not been completed. I am basing what I say on the information that has been released by news outlets and am fashioning my own conclusions based on that, as I am entitled to do. In no way am I saying THAT was what happened. These are my opinions.

I feel I need to add this disclaimer since I am predicting some rather emotionally-charged responses to this topic (if my experience on youtube was any indicator).

Take care all and thanks for reading.

hulkoutlvr · #6 June 27th, 2007, 11:40 PM

Is anyone here keeping sight of the real tragedy here. . .the fact that a child has died. If this guy and his wife had issues and he chose to off her that's one thing. . . she was probably only with him for the money and the fame anyway. But an innocent child, who did not ask to be brought into the world, has met a tragic end at the hand of his own father. That, I feel, is the real tragedy of all of this, whether steroids were a factor or not. And if steroids are ruled out as a factor, that's not justification to use them.

wrestlejock646 · #7 June 28th, 2007, 06:20 AM

No, the real tragedy isn't just killing a 7 year old child--horrible, tragic and inexcusable as it is. The real tragedy is there are THREE dead without any obvious reason. Since none of us was in the marriage, I find it a little bit presumptuous to make the assumption that Benoit's wife was "with him for the money and fame". She's as much a victim here as her son--and she's just as dead. I don't think anybody here was advocating steroid use....just saying that without toxicology results or any other conclusive information the media have jumped all over steroid abuse as the cause for a 3 day killing spree. My point is he seemed pretty on edge for years--like it wouldn't take a whole lot to push him over it.

hulkoutlvr · #8 June 28th, 2007, 02:33 PM

I don't think any of us can make any assumptions either way until the toxocology reports come in. Personally, it wouldn't tax my imagination any if he were using. But then again, I always thought he seemed as though he wasn't playing with a full deck of cards. All of those wrestlers seem a little out there to me; but then again, those are the characters they are paid to portray. Even in his Benoit tribute, Vince McMahon himself referred to what he said was to be "the storyline" for that week's show. As a writer, "storyline" implies to me that what they do is largely fictionial. However, what happened to the Benoit family was brutally real. The comment I made about his wife was perhaps an overassumption based on how I have experienced women to operate. . i.e., marrying for money, position, etc. I have no problem, and make no apologies for, saying I feel sorriest for the child. The choices adults make, to kill themselves, or to live with a man who is mentally on the edge, at risk to themselves, are their own choices. But the child had no choices about with whom he lived. As for the steroids, I make no judgements. I tried to starve myself to death with an eating disorder in search of the perfect body. I didn't find it. If Benoit chose to use, that was his choice. If he was using and its proven that the roids played a role, it's not going to influence guys who juice to stop. Guys who are determined to use are going to use any reason to justify it, just as people who choose to hasten their deaths by smoking justify it by saying, "well, we all have to die of something". I think the best thing we can do is send good wishes and condolences to his extended family and try to learn something, if anything can be learned, from all of this. Sorry if my previous remarks were offensive, and no offense is intended to guys who use. It doesn't make them bad people.

optimusx · #9 June 28th, 2007, 10:46 PM

I'm trying to figure out how 14 hours before anyone knew that they were dead, someone posted on wikipedia that he had to cancel his show due to his wife dying. I dunno about you, but considering that the news reported the IP address pointed to the city for the main office of the WWE... which wasn't anywhere near him... I feel this story is going to get much larger than it already is.

Wild · #10 June 29th, 2007, 03:24 AM

Well, I'm not going to weigh in on what Benoit may or may not have done. I'm not an expert in it, even though news report after news report continues to come out about the situation. I never met Chris Benoit in my life, and I haven't seen anything tactile about the tragedy that happened just a few days ago.

If Chris was responsible... well... we don't know why he did it. And we'll likely not know unless he did leave a Suicide note. There was a case up in Canada, where a man took his child and caused her to die from smoke inhalation because of the pain she was in constantly and her continual degridation. Now, some people see this as a murder. Other people say it was just allowing her to pass on. I'm not saying that's near the same situation as this, bit it does make me think at least.

Some people go on to blame this situation on Steroids. If he was taking them, then it's possible that it changed Chris' Mind set in this situation. But, what I really feel was the main contributor, if Chris did do it (I'm not looking for a discussion about this mind you...) being on the road for the WWE, working 300 days a year to wrestle did a lot more damage to the man than Steroids ever did.

I personally think Vince should be ashamed for working every wrestler in his company to that degree, just to line his own pockets.

hulkoutlvr · #11 June 29th, 2007, 07:09 AM

I'm with you. The Almighty dollar is the bottom line for McMahon. In the tribute on YouTube, there was no grief in his face whatsoever. . . it was like one of his cars had stopped running, so he'll get another. I think Benoit probably was stressed to the limit. He visited my home area a few months ago, and hundreds of people lined up for his autograph. I talked to several people who said that in person he seemed like a pretty nice guy. Of course, that could have been part of his public persona too. . .the side that he was supposed to show to fans. Looks can be very deceiving. I think another blame can be caused on the high stress of fame itself. The pressure of dealing with life in the public eye can definitely change a person, and take its toll. However, tragedies rarely have a good reason, that's what makes them tragedies. If you believe (and I do) that OJ murdered Nicole and Ron Goldman, what was the reason for it? There isn't a good enough reason for these actions, and nothing could justify them, nothing. And I hope my previous comments weren't offensive to anyone. I just find the senseless death of a child so outrageous. . . I hope I didn't type before I thought. While I make no judgements about steroids, I did lose my best friend at 29 to a massive heart attack due to a weak heart brought on by years of hard cycling. So I'm probably a little too close to that subject to comment.

b.spencer · #12 June 29th, 2007, 12:53 PM

As more of this comes out, things just make sense less and less sense (however much sense you can get from the brutality of murder.) There was no justification for Nancy or Daniel Benoit's murders, and I hope that I didn't sound like I was trying to do so.

But, this wikipedia entry thing (a "fan" that happens to live at WWE headquarters posing a rumor. . . come on) Chris (maybe) having legit reasons to have test in his home, Daniel's Fragile X . . . it just seems to go on and on. And if there was any connection between these and the suspicious death of Sherri Martel (aka Sensational Sherri) also last Friday, which has received very little attention. The press though, just can't seem to get enough of wild speculation, right down to painting verbal pictures of Benoit killing his son in a "sleeper hold" and asking was he playing the choking game with is child. (Really heard that stupidity with my own ears)

I agree with you guys about Vince McMahon. Anyone who thinks he isn't out for anything other that lining his pocket with as much cash as possible is deluding themselves. And he's juicing right along with the wrestlers. At least he's not a hypocrite in that respect.

giantw · #13 June 29th, 2007, 02:40 PM

Just to comment on some of the above posts, there was a point I missed which I agree with...

There is something intrinsically wrong with an organization whose entertainers have such drastically shortened life spans. Whether this comes from steroid abuse or simply being worked into the ground, something is wrong with the WWE.

I fear Mcmahon is pushing the bodies of his staff to the breaking point in order to reap a profit. Wrestlers in the 60s and 70s went on to live long lives. A list of the great wrestlers of the past 20 years reads like an obiturary page: Benoit, Martell, Guerrero, British Bulldog, Mr. Perfect, Owen Hart, Miss Elizabeth, Rick Rude...Come on...something is seriously wrong here...

hulkoutlvr · #14 June 29th, 2007, 02:54 PM

You're right by saying that Sensational "Queen" Sherry's death received little attention. It must have gone relatively unnoticed, since I follow the news very closely and this is the first I have heard about it. Can anyone enlighten me on the details surrounding her death. And also, has anyone heard any rumors to the effect that Benoit's son had some kind of health condition, such as asthma, that would have required the presence of steroids in the home. Several health conditions like asthma or COPD (respiratory condtitions are treated with steroid based inhalers). Could these be the steroids that the rumor mills are churning about?

hulkoutlvr · #15 June 29th, 2007, 02:57 PM

What the hell is a "choking game", and does it make sense that anyone in their right mind would play such a game with a child they probably outweigh by 260 pounds? I wonder where that rumor got started.

redwolf64 · #16 July 1st, 2007, 05:04 PM

From what I understand from some Associated Press reports, and I'd trust them more than the usual rumors, Benoit's son was autistic and Benoit and his wife were having disagreements in recent months, his wife wanting him to quit or change his schedule to stay home more and help take care of their son. Since "asthma" sounds similar to "autistic", perhaps that's where that rumor came from.

There was an editorial in Sports Illustrated (sorry, I can't find the link) where the writer talked about the Benoit case and basically called for some kind of legal oversight of professional wrestling for steroid abuse. I think they're missing the point - the roids are just a symptom of the bad management at the WWE. I'm surprised no fan has started a campaign to buy WWE stock and use the votes to throw out the management. (Though I bet McMahon and company have it set up so that common stock doesn't carry votes or something.)

b.spencer · #17 July 2nd, 2007, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hulkoutlvr

You're right by saying that Sensational "Queen" Sherry's death received little attention. It must have gone relatively unnoticed, since I follow the news very closely and this is the first I have heard about it. Can anyone enlighten me on the details surrounding her death.

---

What the hell is a "choking game", and does it make sense that anyone in their right mind would play such a game with a child they probably outweigh by 260 pounds? I wonder where that rumor got started.

Sherri was found dead on 15 Jun in her mother's home in Birmingham, Ala. No one has yet released a cause of death, although the usual "drug" rumors are flying in some quarters. Like Benoit, best to wait and see. She was 49 years old.

Here's a summary of the choking game.

[COLOR=#11263e]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choking_game[/COLOR]

There have been several news stories over the last year or so on it and the deaths, especially in teenage males. Being a wrestler, Benoit would have certainly known how to do it, but I seriously doubt that's what happened.

As an aside, I "played" the choking game myself as a teenager, and there are a lot of guys in the adult gay community who go for some version of it. Just youtube "sleeper" or "knockout" or some variant and you'll see a lot of kids posting vids of it. Just for myself, the effects are very real and can be very addicting. To tell the truth, I'm sometimes still tempted by it, although it's been years since I've done anything like this.

dallasmsl · #18 July 2nd, 2007, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by giantw

I fear Mcmahon is pushing the bodies of his staff to the breaking point in order to reap a profit. Wrestlers in the 60s and 70s went on to live long lives. A list of the great wrestlers of the past 20 years reads like an obiturary page: Benoit, Martell, Guerrero, British Bulldog, Mr. Perfect, Owen Hart, Miss Elizabeth, Rick Rude...Come on...something is seriously wrong here...

Every ONE of those people that you have mentioned lived every day of their lives on the edge. Not one of them would have probably described themselves as "normal" or wanted to live a "normal" life like you and I (and I'm being presumtive about "you and I") with a 9-5 job. They each lived their lives for today - in the fast lane - if you will. No one had to spell out the consequences to them.

But if you've ever seen "the edge", you know that if you get too close, you can fall off. Trying to blame the WWE, or steroids, or the shape of the moon is just trying to lay blame where it doesn't belong. It's called PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.

So, you say, "something is seriously wrong here." What is wrong? It's called FREE WILL. People chose to live their lives like there's no tomorrow. They know the consequences of drugs (and I don't just mean steroids either!!!). But they make the choice to live on the edge. We look up to people who live on the edge, don't we? Who looks up to "Joe average"??? NO ONE!

I'd love to rant on but I have one of those day job thingy's because I'm one of those "normal joes" - well, okay, not THAT normal but you get the picture!

hulkoutlvr · #19 July 2nd, 2007, 06:09 AM

Dallas is right, personal responsibility is the bottom line in these cases, but if we didn't live in a society where people love to entertain themselves by watching people (and in this case, wrestlers) who are human car crashes, there wouldn't be a demand for such outrageous, fast lane behavior. We do, in fact, here in the land of milk and honey, have a serious problem with making idols out of people, and creating the demands that give birth to such tragedies. We expect our idols (and I include myself in this) to be perfect, so therefore the pressure gets higher and higher. The reason the WWE is so popular is because people out there continue to feed on it and support it by buying match tickets, memorabilia, etc. It's kind of like supporting white slavery, given the way Vince McMahon is said to behave toward his athletes. At least I can say I'm not a supporter of that, because I don't watch or support wrestling. However, I am guilty of buying supermarket tabloids, and that is supporting people who cash in on the pain and misery of others. Perhaps I will begin a boycott.

giantw · #20 July 4th, 2007, 02:31 AM

Hi Dallas,

I see where you are coming from, but I am standing by my original statement: I fear McMahon is working his staff into the ground in order to reap a profit. The fact that wrestlers are willing to work for McMahon, of their own free will, does not mean that I should ignore the unabashed exploitation to which the wrestlers are subjected.

McMahon has fostered a unsafe work environment for his staff. His wrestlers tour relentlessly, taking hard hits night in and night out with almost no time to recuperate. Moreover, many wrestlers have felt coerced (coercion is a far cry from free will) into doing steroids if they wanted to be assigned the best storylines and headline major events (i.e. if they and their characters are to be successful). That work environment is clearly exploitative, and I can no sooner endorse it than I would endorse a sweatshop in any third-world country.

I would suggest that, much like in the free market, there must be some restraints or regulations in place for those who feel compelled to make a harmful choice, or who simply know no better. Perhaps sports entertainment must be subjected to heavier regulation to prevent the abuse of its performers at the hand of the owners. The answer cannot be to shrug one's shoulders and say, "oh well, that's free will." I think we as a society can do better than that.

gb123 · #21 July 7th, 2007, 12:02 PM

It's to be expected, anything in the news is glorified and by saying this was because of steroids, gets peoples attention.

It also puts across the whole Drugs/Steroids are bad don't do them angle.

Steroids can leave some users feeling very depressed by the way (especially in a PCT cycle) so saying that it wasn't steroids is no easier said than saying it was.

Sad thing which happened but it probably came down to something more of a mental nature than a steroids one.