Should I take my real life transformation further?

[niko777]

Hi guys,

For those of you who don't know me, I'm the guy who started the thread called "My transformation starts on monday", almost exactly 2 years ago.

At that time, I weighed 180 pounds. had 15,5" arms, a 41" chest, a 15,5" neck and 15" calves.

2 years later, I weigh 235 pounds (55 pounds gain), have 17,75" arms, a 46" chest, a 18" neck and 17,5" calves. I short, I wen through my very own real life muscle growth story.

I've had to go through mononucleosis at one point, which made me go back from 230 pounds to about 175 pounds, but here I am, today, back to 230 and even more.

The thing is that lately, my progress seems to have slowed down almost completely. I eat like crazy, I don't over-work my muscles, I sleep plenty, I eat lots of protein, in short, I do everything right to grow, but I think I've attained the limit my body is ready to achieve naturally right now size wise at 23 years old.

Since I have this muscle growth fetish (like pretty much everyone else on this board), I started wondering about steroids. Of course, I'm 23, I'm young and I have nice long hair, I'm not willing to take some hard-ass steroid product that will make me bald and full of acne. But I did some research on the subject, and I'd be very happy if you guys could tell me what you think about my conclusions.

1) A young lifter like me who wants to gain a lot of muscle mass and strength should stick with testosterone enanthate. For a cycle of 12 weeks (3 months), I shoud take 500 mg of testosterone enanthate/week for the first 10 weeks, 300 mg of testosterone enanthate on week 11 and 200 mg on week 12.

2) To make sure baldness doesn't come around, I should take finasteride, 1-1.25 mg per day/500 mg of testosterone enanthate/week. Nizoral shampoo is supposed ot help too.

3) To keep some of the testosterone to be converted into oestrogen, I should use 1/8-1/4 of mg of anti-aromatase, like Arimidex per day while on the cycle.

4) To prevent testicular shutdown, I should use clomiphine citrate, 25 mg/day, like Clorid.

5) Since testosterone as some effect on cholesterol levels, I should keep a clean diet with lots of protein and healthy stuff.

So, this research I did on the subject made me realize that making a safe and clean testosterone cycle was far more complicated that what I saw some guys do at my gym, which is just inject testosterone and eat lots, but lots of crap.

Could you guys tell me what you think about those conclusions? I'm not saying I'm 100% sure I'm gonna this cycle, but I'm getting tired of not seeing progress, except on my lifts.

Also, if some of you guys are used to doing test cycle, could you tell me about the costs of such a cycle?

Thanks,

Niko777

P.S. (If talking about such things is forbidden on this board, I'm sorry. But honestly, I don't see why it would be, especially on a board talking about unnatural muscle growth...)

[arpeejay]

How tall are you?

I'm guessing you've just reached a plateau and one that you can overcome on your own. It seems unlikely you'd have reached your natural limit in just two years.

I'm not opposed to steroid usage but (a) it costs money and (b) in the US you're pretty much on your own in terms of managing your cycle. All of which suggest (to me) trying to change up things in some other fashion before you take the plunge. You're very young so you have a LOT of growing time in front of you.

OK, enough for now. I'm sure you'll get plenty of feedback, pro and con!

xoxo

Richard

[niko777]

Hi arpeejay,

First thing, thanks for your answer.

I think I wasn't clear when I said my transformation happened in two years. I started working out YEARS before I was 21. I think I started working out at 16. But at 21, I decided to concentrate on a transformation, instead of just working out. That's why I'm talking about 2 years.

I've hit plateaus before, but believe me, this is something else. If I stop eating as much, I automatically lose weight and mass, and while my strenght gains continue, I sometimes even lose size! Like 2 weeks ago, my arms were 18" cold, and now they are 17.75. I'm a the same weight, however, so I don't really get it. Maybe I lost some fat on the arms and gained mass somewhere else...

Anyway, I was doing this thread to know if the cycle I could do was safe, effective and how much it could cost.

Oh, and by the way, I'm in Canada, I don't know if it makes a difference.

Thanks,

Niko777

[dodoria21]

23 is still fairly young. I have to think there's more growing your body is capable of. You mentioned you've hit plateaus before, so this may be a pointless question, but... Have you tried altering your routine alot? Or even just changing up how you train the muscles week to week? I hit a plateau on my push/pull split routine. When I changed to a 5 day body part split and kept it different each week, I hit another surge of growth that hasn't stopped yet.

Truthfully I don't know much about steroids. I know I would never use them, but I don't judge anyone who does. I feel as long as you do your research and go into it safely, then you should be fine. I hope others come along to offer better guidance than that. I do know how you feel about wanting more. I'm the same way. It does seem like you'd be going into this with a smart head so I say do what feels right for you. And remember you ARE a beast already heh. I know you want more, but feel good about where you are already. You know those monster guns of yours have lots of fans here. Take care now

[monstermusclebe]

Regarding your loss of muscle size:
Keep in mind that muscles retain water, and that they use that water during and for workouts. When you stop working out, even for a short time, you lose that, er, "water pump." You may not lose weight... the water simply goes elsewhere in the body.

And for the steroid question:
If you have done a serious bulking cycle w/out, er, doing enhancements, and you didn't add any muscle, then you might consider 'roids at that point.

BUT, especially since you are still so young, be sure you have first maxed out your potential, naturally. You should perhaps talk to someone who is already at where you want to go, and talk about how you workout... how you perform a set, what routine(s) you have used and what potential routines you could still use that might produce better results. Reviewing your diet, etc. All to be sure you are doing everything perfectly... because as you know, bodybuilding requires near perfection in diet, workouts AND rest in order to really grow.

Steroids should not be a shortcut for growth you can achieve naturally. They should be done if, and only if, you have first maxed out your natural growth potential. Because they only help ~ they don't replace ~ the basics of bodybuilding and muscle growth. And though they, combined with HGH, can turn you into a monster of muscle, they only do so over a very long time, when you are ALSO doing everything right with your bodybuilding. They are NOT a magic pill or gum or anything else our stories on this site want them to be. Most guys can expect 10-20#s of muscle in their first cycle, less from there on out with future cycles. But read on.

I thought I was doing everything right, at one time, and then realized one key piece was missing in how I performed a set. I didn't really understand what was meant by intensity, of pushing myself beyond what I thought I could do and into a state where I want to scream. Now that I'm doing that, i.e. being intense with each set I perform, I'm making some serious gains, again. I'm beginning to understand why bodybuilders start to look "meaner" and more "serious" as they grow bigger. Bodybuilding is meant to feel, well, brutal. I finally understand what it means to attack the weights.

And about doing a cycle:

When you do 'roids (under a doctor's supervision!) keep in mind that the first cycle you do will offer you the best % of potential results (from a cycle), ever (so long as you haven't received steroids already for an illness, as that may have already been your 'first time use'). After that first time, the body permanently adapts to the steroids and you then need to do more of them, or more serious ones, and will still get less % results than the first time. So be sure you make your best efforts regarding diet and your workouts, during that time.

I'd do everything I could to be in the best health I can be in before engaging in a cycle. For example, I'd be sure to include foods that help cleanse the liver. I'd make sure that your diet is the absolute best it can be, not just for bodybuilding, but for quality of health and nutrition. Bodybuilders on the whole don't exactly eat healthy... not enough raw dark leafy greens (twice a day for optimal nutrition), they generally don't use raw chocolate powder (which has the highest levels of antioxidants on the planet, twice as many as any superfruit), and then eating protein sources from animals raised with hormones or antibiotics and fed a grain diet (which reduces the micro-nutrients in that protein to about zilch).

Finally, be prepared for when the cycle is over: nearly everyone loses about 50% of the gains they make during a cycle (typically 5 - 10 # loss of muscle). Plus your body will take some time to re-establish it's normal production of testosterone (and note: some people never see it return to normal), and during that whole time both those factors combine to make most guys feel very, very depressed.

So prepare yourself for that outcome before you begin. Promise yourself you will make no big decisions about your life during the month following your cycle (as you don't want to make bad decisions based on your depression) and put in place some sort of support system for yourself for the couple of weeks that follow your cycle: seeing some good friends, getting a massage or two, going on a 2 or 3 day get-away, having some good sweet romantic hot sex, taking baths or hot tubs, etc., to help you through the down-cycle aspect.

Best of luck.

Get as big as you want, dude! Just be smart about it.

[Aielyn]

Originally Posted by niko777

I've hit plateaus before, but believe me, this is something else. If I stop eating as much, I automatically lose weight and mass, and while my strenght gains continue, I sometimes even lose size! Like 2 weeks ago, my arms were 18" cold, and now they are 17.75. I'm a the same weight, however, so I don't really get it. Maybe I lost some fat on the arms and gained mass somewhere else...

Plateaus come in all shapes and sizes. You mention that your arms seem to have shrunk slightly. This may just be your body reconfiguring for future growth. After all, you've been building a lot of size over the last two years.

If your strength is continuing to increase, it supports the idea that your muscles are reconfiguring themselves - that is, the "lost" size is actually "wasted" space within the muscles being lost, which would explain you retaining the same mass. Don't obsess too much about raw size, and instead let the process continue. You might be physically a little bit smaller, but more powerful, and it'll show in terms of definition (when you cut, that is). As a result, you'll probably LOOK bigger. And then, your body is likely to start growing again when it runs out of efficiency improvements.

Think of it this way - you can't just keep getting stronger without getting bigger indefinitely.

Steroids are quite simply not the answer. You're nowhere near the level at which steroids are necessary for growth, no matter what your genetic potential. I'd recommend, if you honestly don't think your body will return to growing while you continue doing as you're doing, that you spend time working out any weaknesses in your diet, mixing up your training routine, perhaps even taking a couple of weeks off (as odd as it may seem, a week or two of no training can result in better gains afterwards, although you will be a bit weaker immediately after the rest).

Oh, and especially don't obsess about things like upper arm measurements over short periods of a couple of weeks. It is normal for your size to fluctuate by as much as a centimetre or two, just because of things like level of hydration and energy, current air temperature, and blood pressure. It's much like body weight - you'll see fluctuations at the level of kilograms of body weight over the duration of a day, so you should only look at trends, and not short-term changes.

[niko777]

Thanks guys for your honest replies. Frankly, I think I could work harder on my diet, since I do eat well, but not PERFECTLY well, lol. I mean, I don't eat fastfood, I don't even remember the last time I went to a McDonald's, hahaha, but I do have a sweet tooth.

I could also work harder in my workouts. I think you guys made me realize that I am gettinig used to a certain way of working out and that I should vary the exercises I do more than what I'm doing right now. Maybe my body is just getting too used to my usual way of working out.

Of course, whatever I do, there will always be this desire for at least one cycle of testosterone, since I have this huge muscle growth fetish, hahaha. But I think you guys are right: I'm way too young right now to even consider doing it.

Thanks again guys, you have helped me A LOT.

Niko777