Deadlifts

[bigbob111]

Ive started doing something ive never done before - DEADLIFTS!

Basically grabbing a big heavy object from the floor and lifting straight up. Only problem is how this excercise interferes with squatting and weakens the crucial back muscles needed to complete the squat all the way down. Im guessing its a good idea to try to do these two excercises on the same day to stay fresh instead of interfering with one recovery day over another. Even just after one week I have felt the difference and added another 45lb to the squat rack with ease. Lowerback muscles also feel alot thicker than ever too.

[inm]

Squat first, DL after.. I'd be careful about squatting heavy with my support muscles (esp. lower back) pre-fatigued.

[mewletter]

Hey, hey! That's what I always do; Squat first, then deadlift. Need to master my squat form first though, so I'm squatting with light weights... As for deadlifts, 2/3 to almost my own bodyweight. (Which is not much... 135lbs)

[BIGJOEY]

you would be smarter to do ddeadlift on back day and not leg day. if your going to do deads on leg day then do stiff leg deads. there is a difference. also make sure leg day and back day are not near each other but seperated and both should be seperated by a day off
example legs tuesday wed off thurs back

[Lucas88]

A lot of guys don't realize the deadlift is also great for the hamstrings, not just the lower back.

When I'm splitting things up, I like working opposing muscles the same day, i.e., chest & back (and sometimes shoulders) one day, quads and hams one day, bi's and tri's (and usually shoulders) one day...it keeps all the blood in one area to get a great pump and helps keep the muscles more in balance. So, with regard to legs, I'll do squats and deadlifts the same day with some leg curls and extensions as finishers. BUT (as INM says), I definitely do squats first because they require more control and balance for me and I don't want the stabilizer muscles already fatigued. If you have any kind of knee problems, be careful about the straight-leg deadlifts...I find they add stress to the knee joints that I don't need. I try to avoid locking joints to maintain tension in the muscles doing the work.

Experimenting is a good thing because we all respond differently to workouts...find what routine(s) work for you, but ALWAYS be conscious of form and not overloading the bar before you're ready.

[BIGJOEY]

If you find your stressing the knee joint on stiff legs deadslifts then your not doing them right. There ae different kinds of deadlifts so it depends what area your trying to hit. Doing 2 large muscle groups the same day for most is not a good idea as one of the groups will not get a proper workout due to your overall fatigue level. Most upper level bodybuilders and beginners tend to split up oposing muscle groups. Also remember that you have the biomechancis of the body involved and as long as you know where to stop on thr range of motition you will tend to over train.

[Lucas88]

Originally Posted by BIGJOEY

If you find your stressing the knee joint on stiff legs deadslifts then your not doing them right. There ae different kinds of deadlifts so it depends what area your trying to hit. Doing 2 large muscle groups the same day for most is not a good idea as one of the groups will not get a proper workout due to your overall fatigue level. Most upper level bodybuilders and beginners tend to split up oposing muscle groups. Also remember that you have the biomechancis of the body involved and as long as you know where to stop on thr range of motition you will tend to over train.

There are as many opinions out there as to what routines to use and when to do what exercises as there are trainers and bodybuilders. There is no one right way to work out and no one routine that someone should do for their entire lifting life. I offered suggestions that I have seen upper level, intermediate, and beginner bodybuilders successfully incorporate in their various routines over a number of years and that I have used successfully myself. I'm not the only person in the lifting world with concerns about locked joints when lifting large amounts of weight. I'm not the only person in the world to see benefits in keeping the tension on the muscles by keeping the joints slightly bent instead of locked. If I misunderstood your definition of "stiff-legged deadlifts," I apologize...my emphasis is on not locking the knee joint and I've seen too many people injure themselves because they don't understand the right way to do them.

[suma]

bigbob,
you'll have to experiment a bit to see what works best for you. Tho most guys never squat and deadlift in same workout.
some can split the 2 lifts say doing squats on Monday and deads on Friday.
for me seems that I need more recovery time, so I only do one each week.

I also think this all depends on how heavy you're going, relative to what's heavy for you. If you're not going all out pushing yourself close to your max, say staying within 50% - 65% of your strength then maybe doing both lifts in same workout isn's to bad.

[BIGJOEY]

there are a lot of opinions on lifting and routeins as there are arm chair quaterbacks. If you want a good reference book try strenght training anatomy by frederic delavier. its about 20 bucks and will give you proper information and what muscles are being used for the major lifts. there is a right way to work out and that is one that useses the muscles you want to train and keeps the ones you dont want used out of the range of motition. its know as biomechancics. the workout design as to what body parts are done what day by most competive bodybuilders including myself are the ones that allow the most recovery to the area trained. If my post was read correctly i stated that if your having knee pain they your not doing it right. Since 95% of most guys learned how to lift from friends they usually pick up bad habits and this would include most trainers. My suggestion is you set up a program and have a experanced trainer or a competive bodybuilder look it over. if your not sure drop me a note. I would be glad to assist.

[Lucas88]

I can't claim to have insight into the workout habits of most competitive bodybuilders or 95% of all the guys who work out (which is some pretty damned impressive insight for anyone to lay claim to), but the competitive bodybuilders (2 that have their pro cards) that I've worked out with over the years don't consider me an "armchair quarterback" so I think my suggestions have some merit here.

Google "supersets" or "antagonistic supersets" or "antogaonistic muscles workout" just for grins and giggles to see how many entries there are, what professional bodybuilders have used supersets, and the caliber of the sites listed. Are they all top notch? No, but not everything on the internet is...you have to weed out the bad info. But...most will give you an idea of what I'm talking about and you can decide for yourself it's an OPTION for you.

If you're lifting super heavy weights like a powerlifter, then supersets are probably not something you're going to do, at least when your maxing out...BUT...antagonistic muscle workouts are ONE good tool. Circuit training is another type of routine that works multiple muscle groups and can be used to establish a baseline and/or shake up your workout. Are you going to max out with the weights? No...but that's not the purpose of doing circuit training.

Once you figure out what you're goals are (powerlifter, bodybuilder, or just working out for fitness), find a trainer that has experience with YOUR goals...there are different mixes of routines that are geared toward different goals.

Don't take my word for it...do some research and ask questions. NO ONE has all the answers or the ONLY answers that are right for you.

[cutlerfan]

I agree with Lucas; you have to figure out what works for your body. After learning the basics you can then tailor the workout that best suits your body type, energy level, and daily schedule. There is rarely a way that's perfect. Look at Jay Cutler for example; he is tremendously successful but he doesn't have the super narrow waist that is the norm among BBers. You have to go with what works for you. I've known too many people who try to pigeonhole me into one category or another in many aspects of my life. Whatever you do and however you train it has to be right for you! Just my two cents, Peace!

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[BIGJOEY]

i was using the term " arm chair quaterback" as a general reference. the 95% figure comes from years of training people and from other top trainers and pro athletes i have worked with and have known. Lifting is as i stated a visual sport and bad habits do get passed on even among trainers. it doesnt matter what you google the whole point is to establish your goals and develope a plan with help the best means to achieve it. If that help is a trainer then fine just make sure they have the background you need for your particular goal. As for right ways or wrong way to lift there are a few wrong ways which usually end up in injury. I did state that biomechanics is the proper way to lift and the best way to avoid injury and you will achieve your goals faster. it was not my intention to make anybody feel bad but to educate.

[inflated]

With proper form deadlifts are one of the best exercises you can do. The big three for mass building are deadlifts, squats, and bench press they should be the foundation of a good workout plan. Strict form is important in these lifts because it is possible to lift a substantial amount of weight-good form reduces the risk of injury.